Executive Podcast #312: Teaming for Success (Part 1) with Chris Fuller

Perry Holley:
Welcome to the Maxwell Leadership executive podcast, where our goal is to help you increase your reputation as a leader, increase your ability to influence others, and increase your ability to fully engage your team to deliver remarkable results. Hi, I’m Perry Holley, a Maxwell leadership facilitator and coach.

Perry Holley:
Welcome to the Maxwell Leadership executive podcast, where our goal is to help you increase your reputation as a leader, increase your ability to influence others, and increase your ability to fully engage your team to deliver remarkable results. I am Perry Holly, a. Maxwell leadership facilitator and coach.

Chris Goede:
And I’m Chris Cote, executive vice president with Maxwell Leadership. Welcome and thank you for joining today. Perry and I are super excited about not only today’s session, but we got another one for you. We’re going to do a two part, two part two part series. Those watching on YouTube, I just held up three fingers. That’s how we’re getting started. I didn’t hold up one finger, though. So we’re off to a really good start.

Chris Goede:
As we get started, I want you to know that we’re going to have a special call to action today. We often send you to themaxwellleadership.com podcast. We got a different one for you, and you’re going to want to know what that is by the time we get to the end of our podcast.

Perry Holley:
I’m going to need to know it.

Chris Goede:
When we get to the end, which means. Yeah, so Perry’s going to be able to take notes. Today’s topic is teaming for success. Today is part one. We’re going to move into part two next week. Here’s why we’re super excited about this. Chris Fuller, who is the owner of Rightpath, is. Is a guy that’s been around our world for a long time, has helped John develop content, has facilitated for us, spoke for us, coached for us, still does to this day.

Chris Goede:
And we give him the hardest projects, and we give Perry the easiest ones. Oh, we weren’t supposed to say that, but Chris and his team over at Rightpath are a great partner of ours when it comes to leadership development, when it comes to culture and understanding, not only self, but teams. And we’ve partnered together on a new product that we’re going to be delivering to teams that we’re super excited about. And so we’re going to unpack that today. We’re going to unpack the importance of it and what we love about it and then how you can use it. So, Chris, thank you so much for. For joining us. Appreciate all that you do for Maxwell leadership.

Chris Goede:
I do want to spend time talking about right path, though, so talk a little bit about right path. I know that’s kind of your baby now. And your focus.

Chris Fuller:
Yeah.

Chris Goede:
And give those that are either watching us on YouTube or listening to us a little bit more about right path.

Chris Fuller:
So ridepath was founded on this incredibly accurate behavioral assessment. And it was founded out of a need. You know, most organizations are founded out of a need. This compelling purpose, and the compelling purpose was that a major struggle point of organizations is fit. Like, how do I know I have the right person in the right seat, to quote Jim Collins 25 years ago, but understanding that there were some aspects of the personality or temperament assessments that just weren’t landing or weren’t landing as tight as they needed to. And so the founder really went seeking a tool that could dial in a little bit closer to that, you know, to the specifics of getting into that. So ride Path was born out of that solution to make sure that we had that right fit for those fast forward. I was introduced to the tool in 2007 as we’re working with it, and what came about was, wow, great insights, greater depth than any other tool that I’d been a part of.

Chris Fuller:
But it started revolutionizing how I coached, how I facilitated, how I developed the teams, and so revolutionized my consulting industry or consulting aspects. And so how you’re wired matters, John calls it the law of the lens. And so this lens aspect was so deeply impactful that fast forward to 2019, I bought the company, and so I’ve really been passionate about making a huge difference, tremendous difference with leaders and teams and cultures through the product.

Chris Goede:
It’s a great time to buy a company.

Chris Fuller:
Yeah.

Chris Goede:
Yes. We’ve walked this road with Chris, and that’s why we can sit here and laugh.

Chris Fuller:
That’s a lesson for another podcast on buying a company nine months before the shuts down.

Chris Goede:
Yeah, that’s right.

Perry Holley:
So, personality and temperament and how people are wired is so important, and I’ve been a big fan and you actually, Chris brought me in when I first joined Maxwell leadership. You’re the first guy I saw, and I stayed after I saw that. So I was pretty pumped about that. Many people know about disc and Myers Briggs. There’s a number of players in this market, but I, because I spent time with you and the team and really learn. I just think this is such a remarkable tool. But how does it differ?

Chris Fuller:
The short answer is going to be the accuracy and the depth and the stability over time. So when you look at the difference between what would be called a personality assessment, and I don’t want to bore, bore everybody with some of the psychological details, but there’s a level called behavioral wiring that’s different than personality or temperament. So personality and temperament are a little bit more surface about how I show up and. But behavioral wiring comes into the predictability that this is going to be stable. Like this is probably part of my route. And again, not to bore too many people, but, you know, disc is based off of Marston. So when you look at William Marston and you look at sort of the psychology of that, the four factor assessments on that personality, but there’s a deeper level that even jungian psychology kind of got into, which is this non conscious behavioral wiring. And so one of the aspects, again, is just this depth of this non conscious, what John calls the law of the lens, this lens theory, if you will, Gestalt theory.

Chris Fuller:
Ultimately we get into how do we understand what moves us and where did that come from. So that level of depth and then again, that level of accuracy and the algorithm that kind of comes in. We’ve never had any more greater comments and consistent comments than, man, this was more spot on than anything that I’ve ever taken.

Perry Holley:
It’s been true and I’ve done it for family members, done it for our team, we’ve done it for our clients. And I love that we have the four factor that tells you kind of how you show up, but then it goes much deeper and it says, well, this is how we get to know you. This is who you really are. And I thought that has been so rich and saying, yeah, you may come across this way, but this is how you really operate.

Chris Goede:
And my favorite part, when the word depth is right for me, because then it goes into the 16 sub factors, which is for me the differentiator with this tool versus others because that right there drives obviously up to the top, but that ultimately is gold. When, when I either when I’m struggling with something, I can get in there and look at it, figure out why I’m struggling or which. This is going to kind of lead us into our next topic. When I have a team member, right, that’s struggling or when I’m not connecting as the leader or I see two team members, you know, struggling with each other, I can get in there and kind of, you know, help look at those sub factors outside of the reports that you guys offer, right? We’re not even going to get into that today about just being able to look at, run a report between the two. But the reason that we are partnering with you on this content piece is really for teams and understanding self is one thing. We need to have that awareness, but then also the power of this tool and using it in the team dynamics is another. Talk a little bit about this from a team perspective and the power of it to be able to drive engagement and awareness and all those things that we need to have a successful team.

Chris Fuller:
You know, teams are made up of individuals. And so I always like to say that we’re just a group. I mean, we’re a group of individuals, and something has to happen for us to become a team. I don’t believe that we can call ourselves a team until we have match commitment. Well, some of that match commitment comes into, to me, being willing, that willingness to be able to say, well, what’s Perry like? Like, if I’m not really connecting with Perry, I mean, you know, Perry’s, you know, like a 90% extrovert on that. And so we can tend towards introversion on some of them. But if Perry wants to talk about something, he’s going to talk about it. And you’re like, can you send me an email?

Chris Goede:
And so can we make this quicker?

Chris Fuller:
And so this aspect of how do we understand and celebrate each other? We’re all wired for greatness, but we’re not wired for greatness in the same areas. And so when it comes to teaming, to be able to understand the individual and collective wiring of the team, and then what does that mean on how we team that makes all the difference in the world? Like, one of the teams we were studying early on was, you know, there was one person that had a little bit of bluntness, one person that was moderately straightforward, and eight people that were diplomats. And so when you look at eight people that are diplomats on the same team, we’re not addressing the issues that we need to address. And so it can actually just the awareness of the wiring and the components that are going to help us team make all the difference in the world around. Do we judge each other or do we celebrate each other? And the difficulties aren’t necessarily. It’s like, I don’t have a problem with Perry. My parents have a problem with Perry’s parents because of the, essentially the genetics that funneled down to us.

Perry Holley:
That’s really good.

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Perry Holley:
We use it. I really have enjoyed so much. I think it’s an ultimate self awareness tool when you embrace what it comes back to you in this assessment, the four factor, the six factor and the 16 sub factor, it really can tell you a lot about you. We use it a lot in coaching, but I wonder about when you’re thinking about individual use of this, is coaching the best way to what do you think about that you set up for coaching? We’re talking about in teams. I think there’s a play on both.

Chris Fuller:
Sides here, tremendous play on both sides, like what Chris was talking about. I’ve got two team members that aren’t really seeing things eye to eye. And for me it’s the ability to look at a report and say, you know, you’re seeing this from a precise factor and you’re seeing this from an agile factor. And so I just want you to see that you two are coming at the same problems from two different sides, precision and organization, maybe as opposed to generalist and improv. And so that aspect of the coaching. But then I’ve really got to be aware, as we talk about coaching around my style, my behavioral profile and then yours, because you may be a little bit more, not goaty, but certainly you a little bit more guarded on some of those things. And so although you’re an extrovert, you have a little bit of that safety factor. Well, my risk factor, I peg an 80 on risk.

Chris Goede:
I recall that, which I’m surprised he’s even sitting here at a desk for two sessions.

Chris Fuller:
So the fact that I’m 100% risk and the fact that you are 90% more stability, if I coached you to my profile, I’m bringing you to a place that would be malpractice from a.

Perry Holley:
Coaching standpoint, very uncomfortable.

Chris Fuller:
So it really is, you coach the situation, but you have to coach the player in the situation. And when you know they’re wiring, you know that what tremendous impact that that’s going to take.

Chris Goede:
So it reminds me of a conversation about, hey, we can’t just as a, let’s say I’m leading a team and go back to the example of the two team dynamics, that maybe there’s tension, there’s two ways to approach that. There’s either I’m going to manage through that, which is go get along, go figure it out, or I’m going to coach through that and this tool allows me to then coach both of the individuals through that, or the team, as I am then coaching the team members. So I think there’s so many different uses for this, to your point, and I know that you’ve used it both in team workshops, but also coaching one on one, it’s just a powerful tool.

Perry Holley:
To understand how have you seen the team, the reports Chris mentioned, he alluded to? There’s some fantastic reports when you have your whole team take the assessment. But how have you seen that used? I know we’re using it now, starting to use it more with the team report. The leader gets a report.

Chris Fuller:
Yes.

Perry Holley:
That helps them almost individually, person by person by person. How do they relate to that person? Is that the real strength in this?

Chris Fuller:
It’s individual and it’s collective. So from the executive team report, that team report, it will compare the leader against every individual contributor. So you can see where those differences are. But then we holistically look at the team and the dynamics of the team, so what we’re able to do with the data, and again, there’s, in people development, I’m really passionate around. Number one, it’s got to be people. It’s got to be emotionally intelligent. You talked about self awareness. 90%, 95% of people believe they’re self aware.

Chris Fuller:
Only ten to 15% are actually self aware. And so that gap that delta causes a lot of difficulty and a lot of inefficiencies in how we team. So when I plot that team, and so when I look at the team, I plotted us, and I plotted the team onto a quadrant. And so Chris and I, although Chris comes in as an analyzer, he actually profiles a lot as a strategic thinker. And so you’re on the networking side. And so I’m a director, and I’m like, let’s go. Like, what are you two waiting for? Let’s get it. And so I’m overdriving.

Chris Fuller:
He’s like, well, wait a minute. Let’s make sure we have a plan and a process. And you’re like, well, let’s just talk through this. And so, ultimately, again, as a team, what can happen is if you don’t understand the team dynamics, the team that I’ve led in the past, I’m like, don’t tell me. No, don’t slow me down. Let’s go. But the team is like, well, wait a minute. What’s the plan? What’s the process? Can we space this out over six months? So the dynamics of how your team is wired, you can’t lead the team you want, you can only lead the team you have while building them in to be the team you want.

Chris Fuller:
And so it’s such a key piece to just understand that I’m not up against you. I have to look at your wiring, because that’s where buy in and change and relationship keys come into really unlocking that genius, that law of connection.

Chris Goede:
And I think one of the fun things about this is that you get in a room together, and we’ve all been a part of these different trainings with teams, and you start throwing the numbers up on the board, we start interacting with those numbers, and all of a sudden, the walls come down. Right. And they’re like, now I know. Yeah, that, like, I totally makes sense on whatever, right? And you just see the light bulbs come off. And when you leave that team, I just feel like the engagement, the dynamics of that team are at a completely different level than when you started the day, because simply getting in, having awareness, putting the walls down, going, yep. I mean, that’s me right there. Right? It’s. That’s.

Chris Goede:
That’s how I am wired. And then they accept you for that as well. It’s a powerful time to get.

Perry Holley:
I thought you were a jerk, but that’s really how you really are. But then, even though it’s. It, they do, there’s a lot more empathy goes into saying, oh, that I know. I really respect, appreciate who you are. And, like, you’re saying you can really help round out this team, because I. We. How’d you say? We’re not all great at the same thing, but we’re great in different things. And figuring out what your greatness is.

Chris Fuller:
Exactly.

Perry Holley:
Self aware. Now. It’s others awareness and situationally where we’re figuring out how we work best together.

Chris Fuller:
Yeah, that’s one of the things that I try to get people. There’s so many times where we’re judged. There’s so many times where we are, you know, quote unquote, even canceled, even within our own department, so to speak. Right. But the whole piece is, how do we celebrate the beauty of who we are and celebrate that genius instead of weaponizing that? So, when I know that you’re, you know, a 62. In my terminology, 62 unprecise, meaning you’re more precise than 90% of the population. Now, I come to you, and I understand you have this high need for this level of detail. So it’s not you wearing me out with details and slowing me down.

Chris Fuller:
It is. If I want Perry to run fast, then I’m going to need to make sure that Perry has sufficient level of detail to make sure that he can do that. So this awareness and this understanding, there’s no weakness on the page. When we look at your one page, there’s no weakness. There’s only beauty and genius. But now, collectively, how do we make it. Us against it, instead of me against you?

Chris Goede:
Yeah. You know, I’ve had people ask me, okay, so, of all the work that you’ve done, like, what’s the. What’s the number one profile for leaders? Like, what? And we’re like, yeah, no, no, no. It’s yours. Like, understanding yours is the best leadership profile you can have, to your point, being comfortable in that and resting in that. The other thing I’ll say about some of the work I’ve seen you do with understanding the teams is I know you have a client of yours that you’ve even used this as kind of a benchmarking tool, right. Where it was part of the decision to bring people onto the team. And I know one of the case studies you shared with me, it’s just fascinating where you would think that this role of a large team needed to be extroverts.

Chris Goede:
And so, along with the tool and the team matrix, we rated everybody inside the company and came back, and we were like, oh, the top performers actually need to be more introverted or whatever. And then they were able to kind of build a new team off of that. So it’s fascinating around being able to produce that team dynamics and that team matrix for even a part of the hiring process.

Chris Fuller:
We reduced turnover by 10%.

Chris Goede:
Yeah.

Chris Fuller:
So, actually over 50%. So they were at 19.2% turnover, and it was a call center, and what was happening was they were hiring people just a little bit too extroverted. And so when you’re on an inbound call center and you’re highly extroverted, ultimately, through some of these things and working on the teaming and working on the fit, we were able to take that 19.2 down to 8.9% turnover. And for a team of 300, you know, that was.

Chris Goede:
They were losing people. Yeah, that’s a big number. Well, I’m gonna wrap this up, but here, I want to say this next session, we’re gonna talk about the power of this tool when it comes to what is your pace for change, what is your confrontation style? Which I’m sure everybody was like, I need to know that. What’s your drive? What’s your relationship? But we always say, we talk about, hey, the hardest person to lead is yourself. The next hardest is probably your team. And what we do know is that you got to know self to lead self, and you better know your team to lead your team. And this is like giving you part a tool, part of the blueprint of how they were made and the team dynamics that it creates. So here’s what I want you to do as I wrap up, I want you to go to maxwellleadership.com teaming.

Chris Goede:
So for short, for teaming, for success there. I want you to fill out that form. And, man, we would love to connect with you and talk a little bit more about the power of not only this tool and the assessment, but then bringing Chris or Perry or myself in to facilitate this for your team and the dynamic that’ll shift, that will shift and happen in regards to engagement, productivity less, you know, less turnover, you name it, across the board. So go to that URL, fill that form out, and we would love to help you.

Perry Holley:
Terrific. Chris and Chris, thank you both. It’s a great conversation. Please join us next week when we continue the conversation. As Chris Gode mentioned, you can go to Maxwell leadership.com/teaming. You can download a form there. We’d love to send you more information, contact with you, and hear from you on that. We love hearing your comments.

Perry Holley:
We love knowing what you think. If you have a question or comment from us, you can also leave that there. That’s all today from the Maxwell Leadership executive podcast.