Maxwell Leadership Podcast: Significance and Selfishness

Mark Cole:
Hey, podcast family. Welcome to a brand new episode of the Maxwell Leadership podcast. It’s a commitment we’ve made. You know it. This podcast adds value to leaders who will multiply value to others. The first one’s on us. The second one is on you. Take this podcast, and as many of you do, take it and impact those that are around you, those that you’re leading, maybe some of your family members.

Mark Cole:
Today’s episode is exciting to me because we’re going to talk about significance and selfishness. For 24 years, I’ve watched John Maxwell pursue significance and resist selfishness. So John’s going to be sharing a lesson that will help you figure out which road you want to take. The road of significance or the road of selfishness. After John’s lesson, I’m joined today by one of my favorites, you know, Chris Robinson, because a year ago on this podcast, he joined me to co host. For one day. We were on the road. It was live somewhere.

Mark Cole:
But today, Chris and I are going to listen in to John’s lesson. We’re going to come back and we’re going to have a conversation about how you can apply this lesson to your life and your leadership. If you’d like to watch the episode on YouTube or download the free bonus resource of this episode, please visit maxwellpodcast.com/significant. So let’s go. Let’s get ready. Here is John Maxwell.

John Maxwell:
Significance and selfishness two incompatible words? Let me give you kind of the background for this lesson today. My wife Margaret and I love to go to cities, and not only in the United States, but wherever we’re traveling and really check out the history of the place where we both love history. We both love history. We both have a great love for leadership. And in one of our city tours, and I’m not sure where it was, but it seems to me it was in Nashville several years ago, a long time ago. I can say that on one of our city tours, we were taking the tour and the bus driver and the guide was showing us the parks and just what you do on a city tour. And we’d seen a considerable amount of monuments that day and people who had done good for their city or for their country. And the guide all of a sudden said something that just really struck me as really the foundation for this lesson on significance.

John Maxwell:
He said, there’s one thing that all these people, all these statues, all these monuments that you’ve seen there, he said, there’s one thing that you have to understand, and they all have one thing in common, that is, he said, you have to help other people to get one of these. You’ve got to be significant. You’ve got to add value to other people’s life. He said, I’ve never seen a monument built or erected for a selfish person. I’ve never seen anybody say, let’s spend some money and let’s honor somebody in our city park for somebody who lived for himself or for herself. And when the guide said it that day, I thought, how true this is, not only about monuments and statues and all that stuff, but how true this is in life, that the person that goes for significance is the person that always helps others. And significance and selfishness are incompatible words. You do not find a person of significance that has a high degree of selfishness in his or her life.

John Maxwell:
You never see anybody who lives for themselves that ever really becomes significant with other people. And so I would like to talk to you on this subject today of these two words and why they’re incompatible. In your notes, I have a definition for incompatible. I think we already know what it is. It’s incapable of, or unsuitable for association or use together. That’s what the word means. And significance and selfishness, they’re incompatible words. The path to greatness comes, but once in life, be sure to take it.

John Maxwell:
The way is marked. Deny yourself instead. Help others make it. In my book, the success journey, I say success is three things. Knowing my purpose in life, growing to my maximum potential. And the thing I wanted to emphasize here, because it fits with this lesson. Sowing seeds that benefit others. This is the key.

John Maxwell:
This is the key, again, to significance. Sowing seeds that benefit others. In your notes, if an entire generation thinks only of itself, what will be left? Even if you’re not around to pick the fruit, we have the responsibility to plant the trees again, leaving something for someone else. Okay, so let’s look at this topic of selfishness or significance. Let’s ask ourselves, which journey, which road are we going to take? And by the way, you can’t take both roads. You’ve got to make a choice here, okay? The road that we take, of significance or self, is determined by three things. As I’ve studied people, I’ve watched people of both roads. I have found that there are three reasons why you choose significance, or there are three reasons why you choose selfishness.

John Maxwell:
So let me give them to you. Your choice is determined first of all, number one, by your motives. Motives are key in choosing one of these two roads. And the motive basically is, do I again, am I going to live for myself or am I going to live for others. Because I believe that a leader always puts the organization above his or her interest. I believe a leader always says what’s best for the organization that I’m leading. And if it’s best for the organization in which I’m leading, for me to be here as the leader, then let’s stay here and be here, be the leader. But if it’s better for me to back off and allow the organization to truly flourish because somebody is quicker, faster, better, smarter or something than I am, then I need to drop out.

John Maxwell:
Now you say, John, how can you do that? How can you do that with an organization? It’s very simple. I had the interest of the organization, which I was leading at a higher level than I had my own personal interest. It’s a motive issue. I’ve known people to hold on to positions, titles. I mean, they may not even be the leader of the company, but I’ve watched them hold on to titles and positions before, and they knew that it wasn’t best for them to have that title. They knew it wasn’t best for them to have that power, position, leverage, or whatever. But they held onto it because. Because of selfishness.

John Maxwell:
All I’m saying is that that’s why there are some people that are significant. There’s some people that are selfish, but you can’t combine. A selfish person never becomes significant. It’s always a motive issue. Well, let’s. Let’s look at the second reason. Some people take the high road versus taking what I would call the low road. Okay.

John Maxwell:
It’s not only an issue of motives. The second thing I want to talk about for a moment is maturity. There are some people that are just mature enough to be willing and able to take a significant role, while others are so immature that they always will live again for themselves. Maturity isn’t an age deal. When you have a birthday, you don’t get, I don’t know, 1820, 116, whatever those numbers are that are supposed to be magic, and you become mature, it doesn’t. You don’t become mature because you just added another year to your life. You become mature because you accept responsibility. And so, because maturity is so key in taking the road of significance over the road of selfishness, I put in your notes this wonderful, I think, direction that will help us.

John Maxwell:
What is mature emotion? Mature emotion is outer directed, not inner directed. I define mature emotion as the ability to see the world through eyes other than your own. That is great stuff. And if you’re going to take the road of significance, you’re going to have to have maturity. We’re talking about two incompatible words. High road significance, low road selfishness. Can’t travel both roads. You can’t be selfish.

John Maxwell:
Insignificant. Now here’s what I know. If you’re going to take the high road of significance in your life, it’s going to be based upon your motives and it’s going to be based upon your maturity. But there’s one other choice that is going to determine which road that you take of significance or selfishness. And the third choice is this. The third area is your mindset. Now I’m talking about how you think people of significance have a total different mindset than people that are selfish. There are two kinds of people in this world.

John Maxwell:
Number one are what I call the takers. And the number two is what I call the makers. And the takers are those who grab and consume what they can to meet their own needs. And the makers are those who make things happen. They give to others, they cause progress and they foster success for others. Okay? And if you’ve read Stephen Covey and some of his material, he talks about the scarcity paradigm versus the abundance paradigm. And under the scarcity paradigm are the takers and under the abundance paradigm are the makers. And I’m going to give you twelve differences and we’ll just kind of write real fast.

John Maxwell:
Most of them I don’t need to explain because they’re self explanatory. Once you hear the differences, for example, the takers, one of the key words that would describe them is defense, whereas the makers is offense. Under the scarcity paradigm, takers escape loss, where makers pursue the vision takers. Number three, safety. That’s a key word for them. Where makers. A key word for them is risk. Takers maintain while makers create.

John Maxwell:
One of the ways that you can see differences between takers and makers is that takers operate under fear. Fear is a very key word for those who have a scarcity paradigm where makers. In that abundance paradigm, faith is a key word. Takers are tight, makers are generous. Under takers number seven, gifts are contained. Whereas if you’re a maker, gifts are released. One holds their gifts, one releases their gifts. Number eight, takers are reactive.

John Maxwell:
Where makers are proactive, very key. Do you react or are you activistic? Takers are paralyzed. Makers are dynamic. Takers have a tendency to be narrow and closed. Where makers have a tendency to be wide and open. Number eleven, under takers, stagnation is so key in their life, they basically have a stagnant life. Where under makers a key word is multiplication. They’re growing, they’re building.

John Maxwell:
And I think this last two word phrase probably gives us the difference between takers and makers better than the others. Takers, they operate under what I call win lose. They’ve got a win, you gotta lose. Whereas makers operate what I call win win. They wanna win, but they want you to win. In fact, they realize no relationship is successful unless there is a double win. Selfishness causes us to think we’re going to get everything that we ever want in life, when in reality it keeps us from the things that we really need in life. So which road are we going to take? That’s what this lesson is all about.

John Maxwell:
Am I going to take a high road of significance? Or if I’m going to take what I would call the low road of selfishness?

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Mark Cole:
Hey, welcome back, everybody. I mentioned in the show notes, truly one of the most selfless, not selfish, selfless people I know is the guy sitting across from me. He shows that in his family. He shows that in his being a team player. Let me just real quickly. Cause I’m gonna talk a little bit more about Chris in one of the comments today. And we’re just gonna have a conversation. He’s watched me lead.

Mark Cole:
He leads beside me. We’re gonna have a conversation about what John has talked about today. But I’ll tell you this. When I think of people that literally wake up every morning and think, how do I give people value so that they will end up better? It’s the guy sitting across from me. It’s you, Chris. The people that you’ve brought into our studio, brought into our offices, the people that you’re always trying to give them something. I think your statement is give them something they’ll never be able to get for themselves. Am I close?

Chris Robinson:
Yeah. Yeah. You’re there. You’re there.

Mark Cole:
And Chris literally makes a lifestyle of it. Probably of all the people I’ve worked alongside for, I’ve never said this to you. You and John, Maxwell will probably think of ways to add value to people better than anybody I’ve ever seen. So, man, I’m glad to be talking about this subject with you today.

Chris Robinson:
Absolutely. Well, I mean, I think that, you know, when John, when he started out the conversation, he talked about the tour that him and Margaret took. And I have to say, you modeled this well. You’re not giving yourself enough credit for modeling this well. But that’s who I learned this from, from you, from John, and how you guys create experiences that people can’t do on their own. And I can remember an experience, you know, just probably January of last year, where you and I, you gave me the opportunity to come alongside you and John Maxwell, Doris Kern, Goodwin, and we went on a tour, a city tour with John Maxwell, and we began to study Abraham Lincoln. We began to go to the different monuments of people that helped other people. And one of my most significant moments was standing with you on the steps of the Lincoln memorial, where Martin Luther King stood to give his most famous speech.

Chris Robinson:
And, man, I tell you what, I appreciate you greatly and the doors that you open up for me, well, it.

Mark Cole:
Was one of those moments, Chris. I just knew. I knew it was a moment that I had to have you beside me, not a friend, not a coworker. I needed you because you and I, we steward this baton of John’s called significance. For those of you that don’t know, Chris Robinson is. He’s the head of all of our certified coaches, speakers, and trainers. 51,000 of them. Around 52,000.

Mark Cole:
Thank you. Who’s counting? Robinson’s counting and Maxwell’s counting. That’s who’s counting. But anyway, 52,000. In fact, as we’re recording this, which this will go live just in the next week or so, but as we’re recording this, you’re wrapping up a four day tour of getting out and meeting with ambassadors, teammates, coaches, speakers, and trainers that are literally changing the world. So, again, I’m so excited to talk about it with you today.

Chris Robinson:
Awesome. Glad to be here. Let’s go. Well, let’s dive into it. Hey, a couple different questions that stood out to me. You know, this was broken down into three parts. It was broken down into motive, maturity, and mindset. Talk to me first about motives.

Chris Robinson:
Let’s go back just a hair, but give me some examples how you intentionally sow seeds to other people. Give me an example of that.

Mark Cole:
Yeah. So one of the things that has really stuck in me, in watching people that are very good at resisting selfishness and pursuing significance. You know, we teach here. You know this, Chris, I don’t think John said this in the lesson today. If he did, I missed it. We teach all the time that success is what happens to you. Significance is what happens through you. And I’ve watched a lot of people get to success, drive the nice cars, get the nice houses, do the nice things, and they kind of get used to that and say, ooh, I think I’ll have a nicer home, a nicer car.

Mark Cole:
And they get into this rhythm because that’s what a lot of abundance does to people. It reveals who we really are. Money does not define us. It reveals us. Success does not define us. It reveals us. And so I’ve watched a lot of people, and so we teach, success is what happens to you. Significance is what happens through you.

Mark Cole:
So I learned a long time ago the most significant moments that I have is when I do something for someone that they’ll never be able to return. I’ve got a friend. She has become a friend that serves us at a little lunch spot that I have here in Atlanta. When I’m in Atlanta, I’ve been twice this week. And as I go up to this restaurant, Heather is just one of my favorite people. She’s got a significantly handicapped son that she takes care of. It reminds me of my brother Philip, and she provides excellent service. So the other day, Kimberly was with me.

Mark Cole:
She was at another table with another group. I was at one table, and she was given the tip. And I told Heather, I said, bring me back the check before you finalize it, because I don’t know if Kimberly’s going to tip you enough. Well, here’s the deal. Here’s my whole point. I tipped her another. I pulled out some cash and gave it to her. That’s not really significance now.

Mark Cole:
It’s worth it to do it. I didn’t have to do that. That is generous. I don’t think that’s significant giving. I think significant giving is doing something to people that will never come back. I’ll go back to that same restaurant. Heather will come in next time. She’ll feel my tea extra a lot because of that.

Mark Cole:
I’ll get something back from that. When is the last time you’ve done something for somebody that you knew there was no way they would be able to trace back to you? Now we’re getting into significance. Now we’re getting into something that truly is about the other person rather than what you hope to get back for what you’ve done. And so when you ask this question. I try on a weekly basis to find somebody to do something so significant it generates a tear. And they’ll never know, ever know that. I have a podcast, that I have a company that I run, that I’m an owner of a company. I try to do it in an environment.

Mark Cole:
There is no way in the world they would ever be able to track it back because it’s just a discipline of do something for people that they can’t do for themselves.

Chris Robinson:
Right. Well, I’d love to give you a gift of a track back to you. I was actually on one of our growth plan calls where we do a weekly coaching call for people that are part of that program. And inside the zoom, I was doing a teaching on adding value to people. And this gentleman from Paraguay is on the line. And this guy, I had never seen him before, and he was like, chris, he was like, I really love you. I really love how you added value today. And he was so excited.

Chris Robinson:
He goes, let me tell you about what I do. He goes, I’m from paraguay. He goes, and what I do is I go into organizations and I teach value based roundtables around this content. Wow.

Mark Cole:
Wow.

Chris Robinson:
And I said, well, tell me more about the process. He goes, well, it’s Maxwell content, but this is what I do, and this is how I’m going from one place to the next. And I sat there, Mark, and I cried, because it was ten years ago that we went into that country to train the first 24,000 people on that value based round tables. He had never heard of you, had never heard of me, but yet we were the pioneers to go there to implement that in that country. But that’s when I seen the loop of significance hit me like a bull boomerang, you know? And he had no idea. I had no idea. But we’re there, and it’s still living on because what we did that back.

Mark Cole:
Then, I would never want. That’s such a great story, Chris. It’s such a great story. I would never want people to do it for this, because then it gets into motives, and we’re getting ready to talk about that, right? But I can promise you this, you do enough significant things, it’s coming back, right? Don’t do it for that reason. We’re talking motives here, gang. We’re talking motives. But I promise you, you create a life of significance. And the get back, not the give back.

Mark Cole:
The get back is better than you ever could have imagined. As long as you don’t start to get the get back.

Chris Robinson:
Right? Yeah. So let’s talk about the get back. Let’s talk about the get back. Cause I think that’s where a lot of people start. When we talk about success, that’s where it always starts. It’s that emphasis on me, what can I get? What can I achieve? But as we’ve seen, as people achieve success, there’s still this hole in their heart which we call significance. And that cannot be filled on your own. That has to be filled by doing for other people.

Chris Robinson:
So what are your thoughts on motive? And how do you recognize a person’s motives up front? Because people all, we all have a different motive. But how do you recognize the difference between a giver versus a taker when it comes to motives?

Mark Cole:
So let me tell you this. I think bad motives are revealed instantly. I think unintentional motives are revealed in short order. I think good motives reveal over time. And too often people say, oh, he did something good. That guy’s got good motives. You don’t know if he’s got good motives. You haven’t spent time with him.

Mark Cole:
You can’t take an initial act now, you can take an initial bad act and go, man, I can identify bad motives quick. I can even call something a good idea, but I can’t attribute it to motives. Cause I don’t know enough. Good motives take time. It’s why John says, you’ve heard him say this, you’ve said this, that success is really when those that are closest to you love and respect you the most. You’ve been on the road a long time. You’re going home to some kids tomorrow after another recording we got tomorrow, and they gonna come, they are so excited to see you. When those that know you the most think and respect and love you the most, you’re starting to reveal some motives because they know you the most.

Mark Cole:
That’s external recognition. Let’s talk internal recognition. Oh, I like to do good things. I like to do this. I have found, in the world of internal motives, identifying myself. Am I doing this as a good motive? You know what I found, Chris? I know not. You and I, we love proverbs, old sayings, old poems in scripture. And the heart is one of the most deceitful members of the body, and we don’t know it.

Mark Cole:
Therefore, I come constantly check when I do something with somebody close to me and go, what do you think about that right there? Not because I want them to give me accolades, because I want them to tell me if there’s something they’re seeing about me in my heart, something about me and my actions that I’m not catching. I do believe that motives can only be revealed when somebody is close enough to you for a period of time that they can give you the observation, wow.

Chris Robinson:
Wow. How do you resist those motives, though? So when you see an opportunity and you want to seize it and you go for it, I think about, you know, even in investing, I’ve got two rules. Number one, don’t put all your eggs in one basket. Number two, don’t get greedy. And every single time I violated, number two, I’ve got burnt.

Mark Cole:
Yep, yep.

Chris Robinson:
Cause it just, my motive is I see it, I want to grab it. What do you do in those moments of when the motive might not be right or in violation of what you want?

Mark Cole:
You know, I love this, and I love to bring people close to John. I remember a time to when John had determined for a couple of years, he said, I have enough. It was a temporary enough. He’s gotten nicer cars, nicer homes since then. But he said, I have enough. Anything that’s a surprise to me this next year. And then he did it the following year. Anything, I’m giving it away.

Mark Cole:
And he said, man, to the day, 30 days later, to the day, he got this washing 20 years ago, to the day, he got $40,000 that he did not anticipate now. $40,000, 2030, 40 years ago. It’s a lot of money. It’s a lot of money today, too, by the way. It’s a lot of money. And John said, man, I got this. And I went, what am I going to do now? And he went, man, me and Margaret’s getting ready to let it out. We’re going to have a great vacation.

Mark Cole:
And he said, and all of a sudden he had this little voice in him and says, no, no, no. What did you say you were going to do with any found money, any unexpected money? And he said, man, I hung my head because how quickly you forget a commitment when the check is in the hand. He said, but I had this little check and I went and gave it all away. He said, wouldn’t you know it? Two weeks later, the exact same thing happened. He said, I made more non accessible money that year than I’ve made in my entire life. He said, so I did it again the next year. So I think that we have to do things like that. That’s one example.

Mark Cole:
We have to do things like that right now, you and I both, to make some commitments to what we believe is supposed to happen in our future. We’re giving up to go up. I think every person in their life, every person in their life needs to have seasons, not a once in a lifetime seasons of giving up to go up. John says that he has had seven promotions to where, six of them, he had to give up salary to accept the next promotion. And I believe you got to put mechanisms in your place like that to keep that in check.

Chris Robinson:
Oh, man, I love it. We got to keep moving. We’re getting close on time here, but, you know, mindset. Mindset is the next component there. And this was really about making shifts. He gives us some points to take a look at some of those paradigm shifts to go from a giver to a taker. What would you say to an individual that is trying to go from, you know what? I may be a little selfish. You know, we may not want to say it out loud, but we know internally, if we’re a giver or a taker, what would you say to someone that’s trying to make that shift from taker to giver?

Mark Cole:
You know, we have a success organization. We call it Maxwell leadership team. But really, it’s designed to get people that want to better themselves to become a speaker, coach, trainer, many of them. And you take them on this track. It’s what you do all day long, every day. Done it in five different cities this weekend.

John Maxwell:
I.

Mark Cole:
We work hard to get them to be successful so that they can be significant. Well, so we can sell success. Everybody wants success. We can sell a better payday, a better opportunity. Bet on yourself. We can sell that because we all naturally do that. But you’ll find in our organization, when we get them to say, I’m going to bet on myself, we immediately to get them. Get them thinking of others.

Mark Cole:
We work on the mind, and our mindset at Maxwell leadership is. Life is about more than just you. In fact, Chris, I got to meet you because you changed your mindset and said, I’m going to join Maxwell leadership team. We told your story just a little bit the last time we were on a podcast. We won’t take the time today, but here’s what I’ll tell you. I watched you borrow money, scrape money, put it all together. You had kids, mouths to feed. You had all this stuff, and I watched you scrape it together so that you could become successful.

Mark Cole:
And successful you became. But the significance that you became is bigger and better than anything you ever did.

Chris Robinson:
Absolutely.

Mark Cole:
Would you agree with that?

Chris Robinson:
100%. 100%.

Mark Cole:
And so what I wanted to do, I just thought of this. I went, man, you know what? Because you’re on here because you developed a lifestyle for you and your family of eight, counting you and your wife. Oh, yeah, there’s a story behind that. Podcast listeners, you and your family of eight, you’ve created an unbelievable lifestyle life plan, but you’ve never lost your heart. Your motive, as we talked about your maturity, but it was because of a mindset change. Here’s what I’d love to do for all of you listening in today. I want you to take a minute. I’m going to show.

Mark Cole:
I’m going to show you. If you’re watching on YouTube, I want you to listen to this little spot talking about a decision Chris made to become a Maxwell leadership certified coach, speaker, trainer, and one you can make today. Check this out.

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Mark Cole:
Chris, I mean, just take just a minute. What has.

John Maxwell:
What.

Mark Cole:
Speaking of mindset, what has Maxwell leadership team, John Maxwell? Proximity to him, being close, flying around the country with him, flying around the world, what has that done for you in this area of mindset? Oh, man.

Chris Robinson:
Well, it’s done a ton for me. I mean, you know, there’s some things that are taught that you can learn from a distance, like from a book like this right here. Okay, so some things are taught. And this is where I started. From a far distance from John Maxwell was through reading books. But having proximity and becoming a member, it brought me closer to the DNA, it brought me closer to other people that were like minded, which then elevated me to the opportunity to have real proximity to fly around the world with John Maxwell. And that is some things that are caught. There’s some things that are taught, and there’s some things that are caught.

Chris Robinson:
And when I get that proximity, John to John and to you, I can see things that aren’t written. I can see things that aren’t spoken about as they are modeled. You know, John teaches us that people do what people see and that we’re always watching, followers are always watching. And so my life has forever been changed because of the model that you guys have put in place of creating memories, the model that you guys have created for, you know, seeking significance over stuff. You know, the stuff comes, the stuff goes, the stuff will follow the right motive. And so, for me, it’s been everything from my life, for sure.

Mark Cole:
Well, and I watch for me, certainly. And 24 years ago, joining an environment like this, for me, the motive really was something that was deep within. I was extraordinarily blessed, as I’ve heard you talk about your raising your parents, your family. I was extraordinarily blessed to think about others, to push past things that would limit my ability to move. There was just something in there. But then we got to maturity, and I’m telling you, the first time I got to lead in my early twenties, there was no maturity there. No, some people would say it still hadn’t arrived. But then I’ll tell you in this last thing that John talked about today, the mindset.

Mark Cole:
It is a daily effort to me. Chris, those of you that also know us, you know that John and I believe of all the people we’ve ever worked with, this, of all the people we’ve ever worked with, we believe a guy that we have observed that uses attitude to his advantage to change his mindset, to always see something that is useful, not always positive, but effective, real is you. Somehow you have done that. So I don’t know if that was natural. I don’t know if you developed it. But talk to me a little bit about how you developed that mindset.

Chris Robinson:
Well, I think it’s developed over time. You know, I can’t say, you know, one I did. We talked about earlier, proximity. You know, my mother is one of the most positive people on the planet. I mean, she, growing up, had all types of circumstances, situations, but she just always found a way. So I saw that as a model, but I couldn’t actually articulate that to you now. I was able to begin to articulate it as I began to go through John Maxwell content, as I would begin to start to read and learn. And, you know, at the end of the day, I remember one of the very first tapes that I listened to, you know, in the car as an insurance agent.

Chris Robinson:
Every single day, I listened to a tape by Keith Harrell, who’s passed away called attitudes everything, day after day after day. And then I would hear it from John Maxwell. Then I would hear it from this speaker then I would hear it from this speaker. And so it really became a foundational piece for me of, hey, look, everything is dictated off of my attitude. That’s the only thing I get to choose. And so no reason to be upset, no reason to be mad. Hey, we can figure this thing out and just stay keeping level headed. As I look at this pen that I have right here in my hand, the reason that I have this pen, this is one of my favorite mont blancs.

Chris Robinson:
I know you’re a Mont blanc lover, but the inscription in this one really defines attitude, which is why it’s one of my favorite. The inscription on there, which you’re going to need your glasses to see.

Mark Cole:
Yes, I got. Yes, sir.

Chris Robinson:
It says that if you can keep your head when others all about are losing theirs, then you’ll be a man, my son.

Mark Cole:
Oh my God. Goodness.

Chris Robinson:
It’s all about attitude, everything.

Mark Cole:
Hey, I’ll tell you what I want you to do. Podcast listeners, John put in here a kind of a comparison between scarcity and abundance, between takers and makers, is the way we put it in the notes. And I want you to do something. I want you to take the twelve things that are on the scarcity side, the twelve things that are on the abundant side, and I want you to take several people in your inner circle, several people that are in your family, several people that you have allowed to influence you or you need to influence them. And guess what? I also want you to take yourself. I want you to take one individual, and as you look down here and say, oh, they’re defensive or they’re offensive, I want you to put a little check their name, check. Now, I’m not getting you to do this to judge somebody or to condemn somebody, none of that. I’m getting it so that once you define that person and you have responsibility to influence them, how can you begin to move them from the taker side of things to the maker side? Maybe as you do yourself, you’ll notice some areas that you have this propensity to go to the scarcity side.

Mark Cole:
How can you get yourself from the scarcity side to the maker side? Because I’ll tell you this, I love that inscription. Don’t you teach your kids this? They get to choose their attitude. What we’re saying is you get to choose your mindset. I think other things in life, we don’t always get to choose. They choose us. But your mindset, you get to choose. And the good news is, if you’re a leader and you think like a leader, you can help those around you to think differently by changing their mindset as well. Hey, to help you do that, John’s written a book recently called High Road Leadership.

Mark Cole:
We just released it. Those of you that are avid podcast listeners, we just did a four part series on it. You can pick up this book. But even more importantly, if you want to take a journey with John Maxwell, we have a digital product that we have created with this. It’s normally, I think, $299. We’re going to make it available to you today as a part of the podcast family. We’re going to make it available to you for $199. Go to the show notes.

Mark Cole:
You’ll be able to click on that. We’ll put in there how to get the book. We’ll put in some other very valuable things for you. I love Chris to kind of close out our podcast with a listener comment. And the listener today is, wouldn’t you know it? Named John. Such an uncommon name. John. But John was listening to the podcast how to lead in difficult times.

Mark Cole:
Great episode. In fact, Jake, let’s put that in the notes as well, that particular podcast. Here’s what he said. He said, this is a powerful episode, very relevant on many fronts. Keep inspiring hope in me and others, John. We’re going to do exactly that. In fact, all of our podcast listeners go wherever you listen to this podcast. Click the link, give us a question.

Mark Cole:
Let’s have a conversation over the podcast. We love the positive feedbacks. We love the times that we get challenging things to listen to. Go leave us a comment. Give us a question. Let’s interact together. Let’s make it happen. Let’s grow.

Mark Cole:
Because everyone deserves to be led well.